First off to assuage the gnashing of teeth and pulling of hair by PITT fans regarding our ‘late’ recruiting start we need to revisit this issue just like we do every year at this time of the offseason. Because of that repetition I am going to be stealing some info from earlier Blather articles.
Here is a bit of info that will help to quell your fears. This table shows how PITT has ‘late’ starts every year since Wannstedt was hired back in 2005:
Year | # Before 6/12 | Total Class # | Notes: |
‘05 | 1 | 23 | Wannstedt’s first partial class |
‘06 | 5 | 27 | DW’s first full class |
‘07 | 2 | 24 | |
‘08 | 2 | 19 | |
‘09 | 1 | 20 | |
‘10 | 2 | 24 | |
‘11 | 2 | 21 | Graham’s first partial class |
‘12 | 0 | 16 | Chryst’s first partial class |
‘13 | 5 | 27 | Chryst’s first full class (after purge) |
‘14 | 1 | 23 | |
‘15 | 3 | 15 | Narduzzi’s first partial class |
‘16 | 1 (3?) | TBD | Narduzzi’s first full class |
So here we see that in all but two years PITT has had only one or two recruits committed before today’s date. Actually, if we give Narduzzi credit for all three of these 2016 recruits actually committed then he’s actually ahead of the curve comparatively.
Now, compared to the “Top 25” type teams we are way behind; those good football schools usually have kids dying to commit to them vice PITT’s having to give the hard sell to get recruits on board. Nationally we are pretty far down the pack also, but again, we’ve seen it before.
The hidden issue is that are these late starts in commitments impacting the quality of the PITT recruiting classes” I’ll have to say “maybe” because I really just don’t know. It makes sense that some of the better prospects commit early to a school they really want to attend, but in this neck of the woods it seems like the top shelf blue chippers wait until December or January to give their verbal agreement.
We like to hope that Narduzzi’s generated excitement about the program would be a real draw for recruits but that is because we are looking at PITT and the football program in a very romantic and totally different way than recruits and their parents do. For them it is an investment of four or five years of the recruit’s life and they need to know they will get the best return on that investment they can. That holds true whether that ROI is an undergrad degree, grad school or the NFL.
This is great for PITT if these student-athletes are students first because our academic reputation is impressive. If they are football players foremost then PITT isn’t that attractive at this point or any other point in the last ten years.
Now let’s look at some other aspects of recruiting in these new Narduzzi and Co. recruiting efforts. We have heard fans complain that Chryst didn’t recruit defensive players very well, as a matter of fact I joked about that in the last article. Here is a very quick and dirty look at the two school’s recruiting over somewhat similar four year spans.
I tried to capture the four year stretch in which Narduzzi had already been at MSU for three years and thus people knew of him and his defenses. The PITT four years are when Chryst was the HC and recruited that last ’15 class.
Again, a reminder that this is an overview of what the schools did in defensive recruiting and not the coaches themselves. I did it that way because Narduzzi wasn’t a HC and who knows what impact he had on recruiting anyway.
Another point is that in their respective four year period the team’s final ranking of the season before is as follows (soonest to latest):
MSU: #2, #52, #16 and #22. That is a great record overall.
PITT: #68, #66, #72 and #70. That is Same Old Pitt overall.
That greatly impacts how the overall quality of a school’s recruiting class will shake out also. You’d think that a recruit would be more attracted to a winning, Top 25 program (MSU) than a school that was continually ranked between 60s and 70s.
Year | MSU | D * Ratings | * Avg |
‘10 | 11-2 W/L | 2-4*, 4-3*, 1-2* | 2.8 |
‘11 | 11-3 | 5-3*, 1-2* | 2.8 |
‘12 | 7-6 | 1-4*, 9-3*, 1-2* | 3.0 |
‘13 | 13-1 | 1-5*, 1-4*, 4-3*, 1-2* | 3.3 (The class after MSU had the #4 defense) Total four year * avg = 3.0* |
Year | PITT | D * Ratings | * Avg |
‘12 | 6-7 | 1-4*, 6-3*, 1-2* | 3.0 (First year after the DW/TG HC fiasco) |
‘13 | 7-6 | 5-3*, 2-2* | 2.7 |
‘14 | 6-7 | 8-3*, 2-2* | 2.8 |
‘15 | TBD | 1-4*, 4-3*, 1-2* | 3.0 Total four year * avg = 2.9* |
Yes, we can break it down according to who actually recruited that ’15 defense recruits but like I said, there is no way to tell what actual influence Narduzzi had in those four MSU years so I kept this pretty generic.
Now, does that info address fan’s beliefs that our defense recruiting will be much better under Narduzzi? One would think so given his defensive reputation but I am very hesitant to acknowledge that unless we see the type of success that MSU had when he was there.
What those tables above really show is that it isn’t so much the recruit ratings that mattered in these cases but who was coaching them at the time. Four years of Narduzzi elevated those 3.0* players into very good college defensive players; not so much with the DCs that PITT had at the time those 2.9* recruits were on the team.
That is where the rubber meets the road in college ball I think. There are so many factors for success at that level but the main one is that direct coaching and game planning so the players can thrive as a defensive unit. That is what we are hoping will happen at PITT.
One last thing to think about with these recruiting issues. First off, if you didn’t already know, Chryst’s staff didn’t formally offer and/or accept a commitment unless;
1) They had seen the recruit in person in a game or in a PITT camp (preferably both) and visited with him personally;
2) They had visited the recruit’s HS and talked with his family, teachers and football staff there and;
3) They had done a detailed and complete academic and personal background review on the recruit by coaches and members of the PITT Athletic Support Staff.
I don’t have the inside info on Narduzzi and staff’s approach to recruiting HS players yet. I hope it is similar to Chryst’s in that he wants the most academically and personally prepared students/athletes to come play for him at PITT.
Do those standards keep a school from getting quality recruits? I don’t think that has to be the case and I lean toward the key being the staff’s ability to find players who fit that criteria and are good solid, hopefully super talented, recruits. We’ll see as the year rolls on.
The whole deal about recruiting is time progression anyway. It is true that for the most part we don’t see on-field results for a couple of years so this issue at this time is very speculative. But every team wants and needs those 4* and 5* players to build the offenses and defenses around so every fans should want to see a lot of those also.
For more solid and detailed recruiting info I read both Chris Dokish at Pantherlair.com and Chris Peak at Rivals.com. Here are two great articles from an optimistic Chris Dokish regarding PITT’s near future recruiting:
Dokish on Offensive Recruiting and Dokish on Defensive Recruiting:
It is interesting that Dokish states right off the bat that he thinks the defensive recruiting will leap forward:
“It’s on defense where the Panthers should get better in a very dramatic way. Pat Narduzzi and his defensive staff can really recruit and players will love to play for Narduzzi and his charismatic defensive staff. But also, there’s a lot to upgrade.”
I’ll agree with him on the ‘upgrade’ thought but the rest, as with all the above article rests on the “Chicken or the Egg” riddle… is it the quality of players that failed PITT on defense or was it the poor coaching and game planning they were subject to?
Another question we’ll see addressed in the near future with this new staff…
Two questions for you.
1-Did you ever drink alcohol prior to your 21st birthday?
2-have you ever driven after consuming alcohol?
I’m not condoning what Boyd decided to do. He broke the law and considering his high profile status, put himself in harm’s way, but 5 months from now, the exact same occurance get’s Tyler a warning to use his turn signal when making a lane change and probably gives the cop a autograph to boot.
Personally, my house on this subject is made exclusively of very thin panes of glass. Far be it from me to cast any self righteous stones on the matter, other than offering a moderating influence on the issue.
Pitt football, like Pitt basketball, is playing the recruiting game above board.
That might say a lot about why we aren’t getting the recruits we want.
Looks like Narduzzi’s recruiting efforts, so far at least, have been pitted.
I see Pitt being bowl eligible but not much better in 2015. Coach Narduzzi has his work ahead of him. I do feel that Pitt alumni are more into Pitt football based on Narduzzi’s “road shows” around the country. I was at the well attended Atlanta gathering. I’m glad the Pitt script helmet replaced the block letter one. Now if we only can change in to mustard and royal blue uniforms… And bring back Hugh Green… 😉
Now that being said, do I dare show up for a second game in person if the Panthers are playing for the ACC Championship in Charolette come December?
Are you interested in participating in a Blather get together at that game? So far it looks like a group of six for that road trip to Atlanta.
I’ll bet not a single person on this site wasn’t hammered at one time during undergrad years.
Still, Boyd seems to be a kid that could use a dose of humility to go with his great talent. As I watched him stand over and taunt a defender late at Houston, then drop a pass over the middle on the next play, I thought he needed to grow up.
This incident may provide the opportunity. 60 hours of community service and a 2 game suspension ought to do it!
Although we lost it was great fun watching AD disrupt GT’s plays before they got started.
The only way we win this one is to score every time we have the ball and hold them once or twice.
Really a shame about Boyd, bad decision to get in the car. Had to laugh about Franklin running a clean program. The next time the University Park police arrest a football player for underage drinking will be the first time. Same thing goes in all college towns. Foster would have to shoot a white person to get arrested in Tuscaloosa.
As for Boyd, he has to man up and take his penalty. I’m hoping a one game suspension only but Narduzxi has to send a message here.
I think community service is plenty, but Narduzzi between a rock and a hard place, 1 or 2 games sounds about right.
In the past 5 years, 25% of UF athletes had some incident with law … 56% of them were not charged. At FSU, 18% of the athletes had incidents, 70% were not prosecuted.
Note that they even showed a film where a Mich State FB played (unidentified) clearly punched another person, and not in self-defense, and was never charged.
One of the implications was that athletes in college towns generally are treated with kid gloves.
Only half right. Peterson will throw a 50 yard TD pass to HIMSELF! Hence, who needs Boyd and Voytik? : >)
Interesting timing and I’m sure a fun challenge for HCPN.
Traveling to this game might be worth the trip…
HTP!
“Pitt Receiver Suspected for Driving Under the Influence” …. is what it reads now.
“Penn State’s Franklin takes time to celebrate Pittsburgh roots.”
And of course this story about Franklinstein could have been run anytime.
But they chose to run it the day AFTER the nite they headlined Boyd’s little underage drinking incident.
But they post the story or rehashed it, to give him and Pedo State a headline story in the Sunday paper, the day after headlining Boyd’s hearsay miscue.
Don’t you just love this type of journalism (if you can call it that).
Possibly Boyd was guilty of DWB … but everyone can make their own judgment.
the cop must have been behind…in his ticket quota.
They are more Revenue Generators than police anymore.
Like to know who made that decision, to run that piece.
Sounds like Tyler was honest with the cop and I think he could have been cut a break.
Not at all surprised PSU grad Jerry Micco green lit Franklin story same day as Boyd and Pitt get bad pub…
That’s how concerned they are !
Damm hypocrites.
My feelings are, since the penalties are so significant and the end result can be so fatal. And the Gov’t pretends to be so concerned about it’s citizen’s health. (well sometimes, not in labeling food if it is GMO or not, etc.)
Will all the empty city public buses I see, trolling around in the evening with no one or near to no one on board, a concerted effort should be made to use these almost empty public buses or vans, or even taxi’s to get these people home and not driving, if legally incapable.
Seems to be, this is a huge revenue generator anymore. And it doesn’t really stop people from drinking and driving. And if ppl lose their license it doesn’t stop them from driving. As I would estimate that 20% of ppl driving, don’t have a valid license.
LOL!!!
Send them this article:
Ranked #4 for arrests with 16.
Yep, the report that had us first with 22.
We’ve been over that ad nauseum here.
4 players got arrested last fall. Some silly egg throwing thing, but it was at a school building or something, caused damage, arrested for criminal mischief!
On top of the biggest scandal in college sports history, child rape by a coach, and a cover up by all.
Point being, Pedo State runs a clean program???
Most of their fans are right back where they were with this holier than thou, we run a clean program, theres nowhere like Penn State” attitude.
When you act like that, and you’re such an easy target, it ain’t goin’ away.
“Eat shit Pitt” and “Pitt doesn’t matter” is ok for them to say, but I can”t say “Pedo State” or “Creepy Valley”???
Sorry, one can only take the high road so many times!!
The taint of the Sandusky scandal is on them for a long time into the future before it’s forgotten.
That guy had a lot of balls telling you “Penn St runs a clean program”
I’m suprised you didn’t just bust out laughing in his face!!
You have my blessings !!
You are doing God’s work my son !
If you’re a fan of child rape, pedophilia and putting football ahead of child’s lives.
They are more redneck than cops in some podunk town in the Carolina’s.
Granted, Doc Ellis did okay, but TB as a projected leader, must do more! Glad he is seeing what it’s like to be a star! You are not in a bubble as an athlete. Everybody knows your business….always.
Comment by Dr. Tom 06.14.15 @ 3:50 pm
….…
There are a lot of you on Facebook, I’ll find you.