That was my point. 3 years of bad under Kragthorpe, two under Strong to get back to where they were with Petrino.

I really appreciate reading the comments the last few weeks – I learn a lot from everyone here. Thank you. (I grew up in Pitt stadium, pre and Dorsett years, Marino… and beyond).

I keep thinking the same thing as I remember those years and as we cover different issues here… stadium, recruiting, player mentality, fans…

The killer with Pitt for years… decades?… has been that the football has been “unpleasant” to watch… just not enjoyable. And this goes beyond win/loss. Even when they would “win” a game how many times did you just sit there in unease and with a constant sense of dread… even the “winning” seasons…. the same feeling you have an hour after eating a Big Mac…

… and just when was the last season when Pitt ‘won’ as !expected!… and closed out the season right (win bowl game!)… Sugar Bowl and Marino??? other?

How many games have left us feeling the way we did in WVU in 2007… Notre Dame few years ago? Too much the exception to the rule… think Utah, Cincinnati here… etc, etc.

Pitt needs to offer ‘enjoyable’ football to watch. That means winning… but as importantly it means a physically dominating football team in the best of WPA style/mentality of football that can get a lead, keep a lead… and do it by impose its will on other teams at key moments in most games.

Everyone… leadership, staff, players,fans, are conditioned by these years of underachievement — always disappointing at the perfectly wrong moment — and just being disheartening to watch. (And it would start with Wannstadt’s preseason press conferences where he would low ball expectations and never dare commit to wins or championships.)

Typical for this dark period of Pitt football… sound and look good in all settings except where it counts most… game day on the gridiron! Remember opening day vs. Notre Dame… the big tadoo-coming out party! ugh!

The most obvious symptom of this malaise is the infamous statement… that can only be heard in WPA at a Pitt football game… “hey, sit down… I can’t see the field”. Pathetic.

“Enjoyable” and winning football — for 1 good season — will cure all manner of ills… poor stadium attendance, top recruiting, national relevance, regional interest in Pitt football… and just getting freak’n fired up!!

And it starts NOW, tomorrow. Pitt has to win and win “well” – “enjoyably”. So that the doubters, even here, can start to believe, and people get FIRED UP about Pitt Football!!!

And there is another big reason why this MUST happen –all the new ACC members just earned their street cred’last week… beating Big 12 and SEC members “enjoyably”… now Pitt needs to physically kick Ole Miss’ ASS and show why it was offered an invitation!!

Chryst is the MAN to get this done… and the time is NOW!

Pitt WILL win tomorrow because we finally have the right coach to set a winning/dominant mentality… finally Pitt paid enough money, and for the right guy.

Rather than saying “Hail Pitt”…. I scream…

F#@$ing kill Ole Miss!!!

I no… I won’t sit the f%*& down!! 😉

Its enjoyable when your team wins. Pitt football just needs to start winning. However, I would like to see Pitt basketball win in more exciting ways like an up tempo game with some press and some deadly 3 point shots. I just don’t think Jamie recruits those types of athletes…that’s a shame. At least in football, we would be getting faster and more dynamic with Boyd. That should please someone who visits this blog from time to time.

Intersting perspective regarding PSU Coach O’brien-interviews with Browns and then states that he loves PSU and committed to staying. Sorta like getting in a fight with your girlfriend, going to a bar to pick up some troll, get turned down by her so you go back to your girlfriend and say how much you love and respect her!!!

The Ville’s turnaround is attributable to one thing: recruiting. That is the lifeblood of college football. Strong may be a good coach but he is a better recruiter with deep ties to the most football rich state in the land. Said it here before, cant say it enough – we need to get in on some of that Florida talent. The more the better.

Also, both Cincy and Louisville have made a definitive commitment to their athletics and have ADs that draw praise from their fan bases, the media, and their peers. Leadership and $$$ are a winning combo.

Dorian Johnson playing in the Under Armour All-American game on ESPN right now. I think Robert Foster is playing, as well.

Emel, As long as the local quarterback is Dan Marino, Joe Montana, Jim Kelly, or someone of that caliber, I’m ok with it.

What’s holding Pitt back besides Stevie? An elite quarterback. And a coach that knows how to recruit and use one. Chryst just might be that coach and Chapman that QB. Then its tinsel town baby.

TX Panther, Talking about quarterbacks, I remember the late Beeno Cook’s comments when asked if Bill Cower would ever win a Super Bowl. After Ben Roethlisberger’s rookie season, Beeno said,”Bill Cower will win a Super Bowl maybe two. You have to remember, the best quarter back he’s had up until now, was Neil O’Donnel.” He went on say, “Y”ou can win your division without a great quarterback, if you have a good team. But to get to, and win a Super Bowl you really need to have a good quarterback.”

@ PittScript, I like the way that you think, but actually the time is Not now for Chryst to turn it around. That time began after Pitt unexpectedly handled Rutgers, with apparent ease, then followed it up with a sound thrashing of USF (although their own QB helped us with that thrashing, pretty well, with his pathetic performance).

So the way I see it, Pitt just needs to keep that two game win streak (that was responsible for getting us into the bowl game in the first place) alive and well, by just keeping that momentum going.

At the start of the season, after the USF and Cincy beat downs, even I was discouraged about the immediate future of Pitt football. So much so that I didn’t even make the trip from DC to watch the VT game in person (sold them to some VT fans). If you remember, both you and I predicted in the preseason that the Pitt-VT game was going to surprise a lot of people, when Pitt brought home the win. Well, of course they did, but only after receiving two bad a$$ whoopins themselves to start it off.

My point is, after the Cincy game, things look very dire for Pitt this season. At that critical juncture, who would have imagined that Chryst could have turned that bad karma around and gotten us to even this point, where we are at 500 and playing in a bowl game?

I agree with you, Chryst has potential, but Iron Duke speaks the truth. The future of every successful program is the recruiting, especially these days when the best of the best are usually gone to the NFL after 3 years. The question on how Chyrst and Company are going to bring in the next generation of Pitt players still remains to be seen. However so far, I’m liking what I’m seeing, with him stocking up on OL players, especially snagging Johnson so far in this year’s recruiting class. If he pulls in a couple more stars like that and he’ll have a great class. Boyd and Hytchye would be amazing gets to add to this class.

Tomorrow could be a fantastic trifecta for Pitt, if we beat Rutgers in BB, Ole Miss in FB and then Boyd decides to play as a Panther. Lets get er Done!

Hail to Pitt! Lets play tomorrow as if we expect to kick some a$$ and just Dis on Ole Miss!

what a dick Herm Edwards is — freezing the FG kicker with 2 timeouts in the Under Armour game

Hope to see some of you guys at the game tomorrow. Tailgating from a white GTI and hangin at the alum tent. Sitting in sect 13(?) row 8.

HTP

@PittScript, I agree with most of what you say, but these are not the dark years for Pitt football…do you remember the early and mid 90’s? We’re on the rise!

Let’s go Pitt! May tomorrow be a landmark day for us.

Watching Johnny Football, he is terrific.

The speed of the game is amazing.

Did the kicker Blowitt?

Panther94, In the early 90s I thought Pitt football was irrevocably lost. Walt Harris came in and saved Pitt Football. He took a discarded quarterback, Pete Gonzales, resurected his career, making Pitt “Wide Reciever U.” Harris put a winning team on the field.

Justinian, agreed Walt worked some magic, but he didn’t take over until 1997, where we went to a bowl game, first one since 1989. Very long drought for the program. I was a freshman in 1990 and left Pittsburgh in 1996, the worst possible span of years in recent history, I would say.

Emel, I’ve been wondering that for years.

Dr. Tom et al., If we get Tyler Boyd today that will be a big win for Paul Chryst.

If we don’t…. then I think this recruiting class is just like almost every other PITT recruiting class and that isn’t good IMO.

I understand completely the factors that have led some of the better targets to choose other schools – RB Jojo Kemp just picked Toledo over us yesterday – and that Paul Chryst has had an uphill battle in the recruiting front this season.

I’ll give him a pass on this season for all of that. However, I truly think that Chryst MUST do better than this if he wants to succeed at PITT. With a program like ours it isn’t enough to get one blue chip player a year… our talent level across the board hasn’t been good or deep enough for one player to put us over the top into conference championship seasons.

Didn’t happen with Fitzgerald, Palko, McCoy, Lewis or Ray Graham… and those are some excellent football players. We need solid starting talent out of each and every recruiting class. It isn’t enough that players turn into starters, that really isn’t an indication of their talent as someone has to be that.

In essence we need more Ryan Turnleys and less Shane Hales.

I’d love to say that I think this recruiting turn around will begin with a win in this bowl game but I’m not optimistic that we’ll match Ole Miss’s team speed. A loss today sets recruiting back again with two 6-7 seasons in a row. That isn’t good either.

So – let me be wrong and let PITT get both a win and Tyler Boyd and then go into the offseason on a very positive note…

Panther94, Pitt experienced two dark periods. In the 90s when Posvar’s misguided academic policies put Pitt Recruiting at a disadvantage with their peer institutions. The Paul Hacket years were terrible and Johnny Majors in his 2nd campaign was not able to resurect the program. The other Dark Age was 1966 to 1972 where David Hart had 3 consecutive 1 win seasons. Johnny Majors came in 72 and the rest is history. When Walt harris came in 1997 he turned things around right away and Pitt became “wide Reciever U.” Johnny Majors and Walt Harris are the guys who saved Pitt football.

Reed the coaching carosel at Pitt set the program back 4 years. We are to a large degree still working with talent recruited by Dave Wannstedt. The best thing Wannstedt did is raise the level of talented players on the Pitt Roster. He brought in LeSean McCoy, Dion Lewis, and Ray Graham. There is nothing I would rather see than Chryst finishing up this year’s recruiting class with couple of big commitments.

Reed :I understand completely the factors that have led some of the better targets to choose other schools – RB Jojo Kemp just picked Toledo over us yesterday – and that Paul Chryst has had an uphill battle in the recruiting front this season.

JoJo Kemp (Rivals – 3 star/ESPN – 4 Star) the rb from FL is still in play. Kareem Hunt out of OH picked Toledo over us. He had offers from Minnesota, Cincy, Akron, Ball State, Eastern Michigan. Rivals has him unranked, Scout a 2 star.

Ok so we can all agree the following has set us back:
1 incompetent and alienating AD
2 lack of elite quarterback
3 not enough star recruits
4 no pipeline to Florida
5 instability of the Big East
6 coaching turnover
7 poor game day coaching
8 no sincere desire by the administration to be excellent and win championships
9 limited booster money and influence
10 pro city with a small core of true fans

I could go on with a few more but these are the main reasons and not in any order of importanance. I think Pitt is making progress in many of these areas so I believe the future looks bright.

Note that Hunt is from the Cleveland area and has been getting a big push from MAC teams (especially Toledo) for a while ….and while scheduled to visit Pgh next weekend,he never did come into Pgh.

Nonetheless, there is no doubt that it is tougher to recruit for Pitt than most of you think. Western PA still has quality but not nearly the quantity it used to have. It is in an NFL city with a beloved team where even Pitt alums prefer Sundays at heinz than Satudays … and it has been playing in the least exposed of all BCS conferences.

Unless Pitt is able to establish a recruiting presence in FL, even if it doesn’t get the 4 and 5 stars, then it will be tough to compete every year in the ACC.

Could the new DC be someone with ties to Florida?

Let me state how much I want to see us turn the corner and beat Ole Miss. Here why it will not happen today. Maybe in a few years but not today. Ole Miss is a energized program. As younmaynor may not know they have been bad the last 3 years. The new coach has them excited and believing in themselves. I see them on TV a lot and they play with passion and heart because they bought it. Most SEC teams have looked flat, etc. I think it’s because they had good seasons and didn’t get up for the games. Needless to say the mighty SECmhasnt looked good. I think that wont be the story with Ole Miss under Freeze. They have solid talent but the programm is excited to make the turn and it shows. Look at ticket sales and that is huge. The support of the program is big where we have a few thousand fans that will go to the game. It’s all about where a program is and where they are heading. Tis Ole Miss team had LSU beat and close with Tex AM. If you are a betting man this is easy money in my opinion. Hopefully we can pull it out but I don’t see Chryst having the talent, gameplay to do so this year. I hope I’m wrong but at the end of the day we have Tino as our QB. Go Pitt!

wbb, Yes, western PA isn’t the epicenter of the nation’s football talent, as once was, but we still have good talent in the area. From a recruiting standpoint, it’s the local players with whom Pitt has the best probability of getting. So you absolutely have to after them as a priority. Getting the top talent from Florida to come here is a more difficult task. We still need to go after them none the less. For the most part, the Florida players that you would a shot with, will be those flying under the radar. So you take a few more chances with sleepers or players who need refinement. I think the Panthers need to do a much better job locally in western PA and Ohio and re-establish links in New Jersey and Maryland. Dave Wannstedt got a lot of players from New Jersey. In addition to that, Pitt needs to look in Florida, for players who have talent and are receptive to playing here.

did you guys check out the designs on facebook from the graphic artist from pitt? he has a bunch of cool designs for pitt that would be a welcome change as we head to the acc.

The top kids in Florida will not choose Pitt over UF, Fla. St. Miami, LSU, Bama, etc. we need to get the 2 stars and the kids that were passed up. Teddy Bridgewater left and where did he go? l’Ville to play for Strong and his Florida roots. We need someone with Strong ties, a Floridian, to connect with both parents and kids alike. We also need that same thing here in Texas. These are the talent hotbeds.

Pittisit37 – they are awesome.

i agree upittbaseball and i hope the administration takes notice. the guys seems to have talent and is passionate about pitt.

also, so excited for tino’s last game! can we retire/burn number 12 so we never have to see it worn again!

acc comish better be pulling a rabbit out of his hat, word has it he has got the hat,or we will be on the otherside of the 65 teams looking in.alot of crazy net rumors out there, but be worried about the ones you are not seeing, come on chas, print them.sad post pittsit37.sorry no caps ,i like the pens.pitt in a slugfest 20-14

Here’s the thing about recruiting though…Pitt is not a prestige school that can pull in blue chips on name and reputation, but it does have specific advantages, namely that there is still a rather strong albeit more shallow talent pool in its backyard. Here’s a list of schools that do not have that advantage and have done ok: Oregon, Kansas St., Boise St., Nebraska, Wisconsin, Louisville, West Virginia…hell throw UConn in there, they’ve been to a BCS more recently than we have. Point being it can be done at Pitt, with arguably less effort than at many schools.

Justinian, I’m certainly not saying that getting the locals isn’t important … certainly we need them as a base for the roster.

However, just look this past decade as to how good the Florida recruits (ALL who have been passed over by SEC, Miami and FSU) have been. Antonio Bryant, Greg Lee, Torrie Cox, Clint Session, HB Blades, Jameel Brady, Gus Mustkas, Greg Romeus, Shane Gordon were all passed over by the bigger southeastern schools … and these guys are just from the top of my head … I’ll guarantee there arejust as many I have forgotten.

But it takes good recruiters to spot these diamonds in the rough. Does Pitt have any at the moment?

Reed, why so serious? Listening to you, it sounds like Pitt has nothing but unranked recruits committed to the program amd little hope for snagging guys who are still in play as uncommitted.

I disagree with you on the current class NOT being good, Right now it is NOT great but it IS good in the sense that it addresses the #1 glaring weak position that has hindered Pitt historically as of late and that is at the offensive line position. Besides Dorian Johnson, Chryst has 3 other quality OL recruits on board already. Another 3 star recruit out of Philly, Jaryd Jones-Smith is another uncommitted OT that has visited Pitt and is still on the radar too.

Now with Chryst also moving TJ Clemmings over to the offensive tackle position for the Spring, this reoccuring issue of being thin on the OL seems to have been adequately addressed in Chryst’s first recruiting class.

Now I’m not real big on recruiting site star ratings for HS kids but our entire class so far are solid 3 stars across the board,,, almost. Considering guys like Tra’von Chapman, Zach Challingworth, Chris Blewitt and Titus Howard, these guys have already proven their worth at the HS level and could bloom into stars at Pitt.

Chris Blewitt is a local kid from my area down here in Washington DC and I can tell you from his play at Potomac HS, this kid is going to be money in the kicking dept for us. He has already kicked clutch 50 yard field goals when needed for his HS team. So pardon me for disagreeing with you, but this class has potential right now as it stands, even if we don’t bring in one more quality recruit.

And in considering Tyler Boyd’s situation, we already have one good Clairton player in Titus Howard a 6’2″ CB. We also have another guy, Terrish Webb from Clairton, seriously considering Pitt as well because of Howard already coming on board with Pitt. Webb is also a WR and the only reason he is a little under the radar is that he was playing in the shadow of Boyd during his HS career. So who knows, we could end up with a trifecta from Clairton in this class when it is all said and done.

There is another guy a DT that is leaning towards Pitt too, Kenton Gibbs out of Detroit, he is definitely in play at this point. So this recruiting game is far from over. Come LOI signing day Pitt could be flush with 25 or more recruits, all with good potential.

So lighen up Reed, especially if we snag both Boyd and Hytchye, this class should pan out just fine.

Who recruits Texas and Deep South for Pitt? Who recruits Florida? Are they Texans? are they Floridians? White Guys from Wisconsin? Ex Ball Players from UF, Miami? UT, Tex AM? Do you see where I’m going with this? We need local guys from those markets that now live and coach up north. There is so much talent in those markets guys like Blades, Bryant, etc are passed up. We need to eat sleep breath in those markets. If you have. Teams of wpial kids you can’t win the MAC let alone a real Conf.

Not sure why guys keep dinging Posvar and Bozik. Granted Gottfried was fired in the face of the academic standards change and the athletic programs fell into a malaise afterward. However, given that he never coached again, the fact that Gottfried left may not have been that significant. Posvar’s raising of the academic standards is in part what allows people to throw Pitt’s academic standing in the face of schools like WVU. After all, these kids are ostensibly supposed to be students first, and athletes second. It’s not supposed to be a trade school or the development league. Let the crap fall on that one!

An excerpt of the 1989 academic change:

Pitt will require prospective student-athletes to have a 2.3 grade-point average and a minimum 750 Scholastic Aptitude Test score. The NCAA requires a 2.0 average and a 700 score.

Really? That’s pretty daunting stuff.

Pitt’s last relatively significant bowl victory was in the 2010 Meineke Car Care Bowl. They beat a stacked North Carolina team that included Hakeem Nicks. NC ended up vacating wins due to academic cheating and improper benefits. That bowl victory was after Pitt essentially lost the Big East Championship at Heinz Field to Cincinnati (coached by Brian Kelly) 45-44 in the most exciting game that I have personally witnessed. Pitt effectively lost because they couldn’t cover two Mardy Gilyard kickoff returns and Pitt’s holder botched a good snap on a PAT after Pitt’s final TD. We can argue about Dave Wannstedt’s culpability in those failures, but let’s not revise history too much. Let the crap fall on that one too.

Barvo, just like blaming all of last year’s basketball woes on Woodall’s injury, many Pitt fans seem to like to blame just one person for its teams’ failures. Before it was Wanny, and now Tino for these past 2 years even though Tino won 8 games in his very first year as starter … under Wanny!!

I certainly hope that a new QB will make evrything better for Pitt FB next year …. athough my bet it would be more because of 9 starters returning on defense (note that Pitt started this year with 8 defensive starters who had very little experience.)

@Dr. Tom. Thank you. Your points are well taken and correct. You guys are right about Iron Duke’s statement as well… I guess my take on that is this is a chicken-egg scenario.. .what comes first… good play or recruits. Yes recruits, and if they know they are coming to a tough team with the right energy… even if the wins aren’t there yet, then it is easier.

Today goes a long way to solidifying the foundation but you guys are right about the bottom line… need the players.

@Panther94…. yeah you are right there… I was exaggerating a little bit to make the point.

Now I understand the history from the above posts! thanks, I was watching games for 2-3 yrs before Majors turned things around… dark days indeed!

Today is the day Pitt earns its invitation to the ACC and shows everyone a new day has dawned! Good “enjoyable” football and a WIN.

Hail Pitt… Kick $$…

no graham shuffled oline lets start blaming u know who , why wait , gets ur final cheap shots in early, pitt now 20-18.

Bad start for sure.

This this like the BB game or what.