In totally untimely news, Joe Paterno finds himself in hot water due to the inability of the PSU administration to actually discuss things face to face over coffee instead of sharing their thoughts in an email.
Damn, this gives the PSU faithful another target to point fingers of blame at other than Paterno… “If it wasn’t for computer technology Joe wouldn’t be in trouble!” As if they need any more basis for rationalization that is. Here is my favorite from a PSU poster.
“Even if true this doesn’t establish “cover up” as the motive. I think its quite likely that they wanted to help an old loyal friend, to get him professional help in the belief that it would halt the conduct without destroying his life and reputation. Obviously, that was a bad decision and very misplaced. But making a horribly wrong decision isn’t the same as covering up a scandal to protect the football program.”
Allll righty then…!!!
Maybe Paterno is glad he’s dead so that he doesn’t actually have to face the public and tell the truth, something that he’s proven he can’t be counted on to do in the past.
In case anyone has been in a coma these last three days a series of emails between the AD Curley and the President Spanier have been quoted in CNN articles (and now by AP stringers) that show “Joe” (Paterno) was complicit in not alerting the authorities back in 2001 after the four principals had gotten McQueary’s report of the shower incident.
If you’ve the stomach for it here are a few excerpts:
“…then Vice President for Finance and Business Affairs Gary Schultz developed a three-part plan to talk with Sandusky; contact the Second Mile — the youth charity Sandusky founded; and inform child welfare authorities.” and “But that plan was put on hold, the report stated, Feb. 27, when Schultz received an e-mailed reply from Athletic Director Tim Curley — apparently after a discussion with head football coach Joe Paterno — in which Curley suggests talking with Sandusky directly before alerting any outside authorities.”
What happened then is the most damning as far as Paterno is concerned…
In an email from Schultz to Spanier came this. “After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday, I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps,” CNN quoted Curley as saying in an email. Curley indicated, according to the report, that he planned to talk with Sandusky and also contact The Second Mile, but not necessarily the child welfare office if Sandusky cooperated and got professional help.
Cooperated and got professional help. Oy Vey, Goot Gott In Himmel!
This brings up the question if Sandusky was confronted and agreed to those stipulations. If so, and if I were the DA, I’d want the name of that therapist who didn’t alert authorities that Sandusky remained a ‘danger to others’. But you know that never happened and that PSU didn’t give a damn if it did. They just wanted silence at all costs.
Then this bombshell which, to me, is the most sickening insight into these men’s minds when Spanier wrote “I am supportive,” Spanier emailed Curley, according to the e-mails obtained by CNN. “The only downside for us if the message isn’t heard and acted upon, and then we become vulnerable for not having reported it.”
“the only downside…then we become vulnerable…”
That is so damn twisted I really can’t put into words how I feel so I’ll direct you to someone who is more eloquent on this issue. Greg Doyle’s CBS Sports’ article sums it up very well.
” (emails) that showed the Penn State officials deciding to do the right thing: They would confront Sandusky, they would speak with the folks at his Second Mile grooming grounds, and most importantly they would report the incident to the Department of Welfare.
If there was anything to stop in March 2001, by God, that would have stopped it.
But then they changed their mind. Why?
Because Joe Paterno got involved.
“….because Joe Paterno got involved.” ‘Nuff said. This isn’t shocking. We have heard and read for years that Paterno had an over sized ego when it came to his and his football program’s reputations. We previously learned how he forbade PSU to allow their own administrative officers to discipline his players.
He and himself alone would determine which, if any, punishments would be handed down. If not? Well then he’d resort to extortion and refuse to do any more fundraising for the university. Here is the prime example of that ego and power.
In April 2007, as many as two dozen football players forced their way into a party at an off-campus apartment and assaulted several students , including Britt’s son, Jack, who was severely beaten. Six players faced criminal charges as a result of the brawl. In the end, many of the charges against the players were dismissed, and two players pleaded guilty to misdemeanor offenses.
In the middle of the school’s internal investigation, Triponey said Spanier ordered her to meet with Paterno. Triponey said she had repeatedly refused to discuss cases with Paterno because she didn’t want to compromise her impartiality. “The coach was not happy with that,” Triponey said in a phone interview with USA TODAY. “Many times he tried to insist upon a meeting with me, asked others to have meetings with me. Sent his wife (Sue) one time. In the middle of cases. This became a bone of contention.”
“The coach was literally telling his players that they couldn’t cooperate with judicial affairs or they would get kicked off the team. So we were going nowhere in getting to the bottom of things,” Triponey said. “I said to the coach, ‘This would be so much easier if you would tell your players just to tell the truth.’ He was livid, and the message to me was, ‘I can’t do that. They have to play for me and I can’t ask them to rat on each other.’ The president also chimed in and said, ‘Vicky, the coach is right. We can’t expect the players to tell the truth.’ So that’s the environment that was underlying this whole debate about who’s in charge.”
Football won. “The sanctions that were issued were nowhere near being in line what the code required for the severity of the offenses,” Triponey said.
As big a story as that was then, by the way also pooh-pooh by the PSU faithful, it completely pales in comparision to Paterno being not only compliciate but actively working to keep the Sandusky abuses private. For years we have read about how Paterno remember player’s parents and asked of their health; how he called old players to offer support; how he donated $5M for an on-campus library and many other acts of compassion that Paterno did.
But his greatest and hardest test of compassion? He passed on it. He looked in the mirror and saw a King instead of a human being who has responsibility to those weakest of society’s members. Not only did he abstain from compassion he refused to even consider it.
We are now seeing the mask of Joe Paterno being slowly peeled off with every bit of truth lent to the fact that not only did he know what evils Sandusky was visiting on children, but that he turned a blind eye to further his own good standing.
Trading future child rape for the sake of his own reputation. I suppose that was the real “Penn State Way”.
The crimes committed beckon for righteous judgment but this is 21st century America. Strange judgments from judges and in particular juries. The whole thing is sad to say the least. If you or me did such a thing we would be in jail for a long time. But money talks and big money at times lets people walk. I am not holding my breath in respect to see full justice implicated in this sordid affair…
If these emails are not a smoking gun, I don’t know what is. The only down side is if we get caught. Damn the kids that have been raped and will be raped as a result of the choice we make. They were ready to pull the trigger and Paterno said no. Read between the lines.
DAMN THEM ALL!
Too bad most of the perpetrators are gone and thoseleft behind at the school will suffer. But a message has to be sent even if there is collateral damage to the left behind students (who i do no pity — school is not about football) and faculty, etc. No matter how large a brand is, we cant tolerate it being put ahead of all things, especially something as heinous as this.
Paterno thought McQueary was calling that day to petition for a coaching job. Before McQueary could say a word, Joe yells “no, you’re not getting the job.”
Then Paterno hires McQueary over way more qualified candidates.
“Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are always bad men.” How come nobody ever heeds Lord Acton’s words?
PSU would not allow those white uniforms to get dirty with the backlash that would occur by admitting the pedo crimes that occurred on campus football facilities, away game road trips, and even the bowl game experiences were soiled. Which takes you back to NCAA lack of institutional controls as the motive for the cover up which had nothing to do with Jerry but rather protect PSU football.
So athletically they failed to clean up their act. Administratively PSU didn’t learn anything they hire as their new president within the PSU University , someone who could help coverup the dirt , rather than go outside to find Spanier’s replacement. You can’t heal PSU without going outside their dirty web and hire a President with no ties to PSU.NCAA should weigh those hiring decisions when determining the level of guilt at PSU – DEATH Penalty.
Also, if you have not read the PG today you have to go to their web page. If you want to teach your kids what propaganda is there you have it. You can’t make this stuff up. The headline regarding Penn State reads: “Penn State Planned to Report Sex Abuse”. PLANNED????? The PG is doing exactly what Penn State did; they are trying to cover up the reality. Oh,really judge, we planned to report it, we just never got around to it. Now we all know the sports editor their is a PSU grad, but come on! Notice on the sports page, there is NO reference to the story. This is why nobody respects the mainstream media anymore. They no longer “report” the news, they only publish what they want to say which is designed to influence the reader to suit their side of the story. How sad. Actually, pathetic comes to mind.
Maybe Joe, reincarnated as a 9 year old boy, is having unwanted sex in Hell at this very moment and is waiting in vain for an adult to do something…anything to stop it…but to no avail.
Just a thought.
I think the death penalty should be enforced. Will it? Highly unlikely. Whats more likely is a bowl ban and a few less scholarships for a couple years. It will mean absolutely nothing. The death penalty is the only punishment, imo, that will actually negatively hurt the program. Lets face it, hiding decades of child rape is worse than smu paying players… By a fuckin long shot! You can look at it two ways. 1) the dp was enforced for repeat offenders and psu has never been sanctioned before, henceforth, lesser punishment. 2) this is far, far, a FAR worse example of a “lack of institutional control” than payin a freakin kid to play football, whether that school was repromanded an infinite amount of times
Yahoo/Rivals Mike Hugenin NCAA football writer did a pretty thorough Team Preview of team #48 PITT.
*note he calls Sir Tino, Sal…lmao.
“Because at this point it is a risk that each and every one of these kids and their families have weighed and decided it wasn’t too big to sway them. Again – right now these kids are semi-gods for choosing PSU when the chips are down and their parents won’t have to buy a drink in Happy Valley until death.
What motivates football players who have been told how great there are week after week for years? Praise is one thing. These kids are and will be getting that heaped on their shoulders.
When a regular PITT player has finished his career and moves on he gets “Hey, you played for us, thanks. Can I get you a beer?” What each of these recruits are going to get is “OMG, you were with us after the scandal! You’re my hero… thank you, thank you, thank you, …take my daughter and give her your baby, please!”
We already know PSU football was cult like – do you really think that’s going to diminish if PSU doesn’t get the death penalty, of maybe even if they do?
These families aren’t stupid, they know what they are getting into. If a player is good enough to be considered for the NFL by his JR year that probably won’t change. If he’s not then he plays ball somewhere else for a year or sticks with PSU and gets a decent education.
This is also why we have seen a total of two defections from the PSU squad so far after this scandal broke – both were disciplinary issues and not because PSU football was in danger.
There were some of us on here swimming against the “PSU is doomed” tide last November when that Grand Jury report was made public. I, and others, were adamant that the PSU recruiting or the program wouldn’t go south no matter who was hired as the HC and this blind following is the reason. It isn’t that it shouldn’t tank, it is that it won’t. PITT fans scratch their heads at how these kids can make this decision but PSU is going to roll into what may be their best recruiting class ever when it’s LOI Day rolls around.
Many people want to be associated with Penn State football no matter what. It is just true. I wouldn’t want to be, you wouldn’t and many others wouldn’t either but we are seeing that desire writ large as more nasty things unfold daily and we’ll keep seeing it even during the perjury trial when things will get really hot.
It is a strange and abnormal thing maybe but when you get a kid and his family up to State College, show them around, have mere mortals slobber on their boots and then take them in front of 110,000 seats at Beaver Stadium with his name blaring from the loudspeakers – they get stars in their eyes.”
They ALL need to be put on trial and then after being convicted, need all their Ped State pensions and such terminated and sentenced to long prison sentences. And then placed in cells with very large men named Bubba.
And Paterno got off to easy by convienently dying.
Since he knew the truth would eventually come out and his lifetime Pedo Pal Sandusky would end up in prison and his JoePa the King image would be torn down, much like the statue of Saddam Hussein was pulled down in Baghdad. Would not be surprised at all if JoePa offed himself, much like Frankie Pentangeli in Godfather 2. The code of Omerta certainly embraced Creepy Valley. Go figure.
This may be PSU’s first major violation, I don’t know for certain, but there can’t be anything worse than protecting a child predator for the sake of revenue. The NCAA has to hit them with the strongest of sanctions! I really can’t see how anyone with any moral fiber, integrity and/or honor play for that institution due to the latest revelations. If that isn’t enough, then not knowing how the NCAA is going to punish this place should do it. I really believe this news has to cause any athlete with half a brain cell working to seriously reevaluate their verbal pledge now.
Of course in this day and age of television game revenue it will be very interesting to see how the NCAA acts. Will they have the “cajones” to do the right thing against this large, out-of-control institution? If not, then they would be leaving the foundation for additional violations to brew. I really don’t think this can be ignored now that evidence proves the HC, AD and UP were involved.
I’m as guilty as the next – I just watched Tiger win and was rooting for him even though he is most likely an awful person off the course. I’ve had my wife state several times that she can’t believe I still root for him and my answer every time is that I feel ripped off if I’m missing the greatest golfer of my generation underachieve. I feel entitled to witness greatness regardless of what he does in his personal life I want to see the best be the best. I even rationalize it with the idea that people with Tiger’s type of mentality are typically flawed. It’s not necessarily true or even makes it right but I can satisfy my own moral objections with that justification.
Additionally, people fall in love with their schools and to expect PSU alumni to abandon their own history and experiences is just asinine. It’s human nature to try and rationalize a bad situation. There’s a reason denial is always part of a recovery program. I can’t really fault them for doing it. You have to remember they didn’t play a part in the scandal and their worlds are being rocked (this statement is not meant to be insensitive to the Sandusky victims – it’s just a reflection of the state of Penn State fans). They are trying to cope through denial and justification. Pitt fans, and the rest of the country, are removed from the situation and can be much more rational with our responses.
As long as 100,000+ are still showing up for games, recruits will come. The only way to break or crack this lifeline is to administer a punishment that hits the University at it’s core. If the NCAA doesn’t hit the school hard, the Big Ten should step in. If there is any justice in the world Penn State football will be disciplined severely.
“After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday, I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps.” does not equal “Joe Paterno is the master puppeteer of State College putting pride and legacy before children’s welfare.”
None of the PSU officials knew about the other cases. They only had the weak testimony of McQueary (I say weak because he was acquitted of the strongest charge for victim 2) to go by. Stop making implying they knew of more victims or allowed this to go on for years.
Maybe start asking questions about the Second Mile, the 98 investigation, Corbett, Gricar, and such instead.
[An] unnamed source told the Chronicle some of the Freeh investigators “appeared to find it problematic” that some top Penn State officials had resisted adopting athletic oversight practices in use at many other schools.
[…]
“We’ll have to wait to see what the Freeh report finds,” (current university President Rodney) Erickson said. But, he added, “We will take responsibility for whatever is identified in the Freeh report, and we will make changes that address any issues that are raised.”
The cat I know…who has been right all along…everything has been spot on….dirctly said PSU is preparing for the death penalty! He does not think that will happen in whole but PSU will be sanctioned worse than any other program since SMU….but with the Sandusky shit thrown in….death may be the only answer for the public outcry! U hheard it first here….PSU football is done for seveal years. These jack ass parents need to do their homework and see that this program is all but over.
What’s your point Kyle? That just 1 dastardly rape doesn’t count morally or legally? That there’s gotta be more than 1?
Your fellow panther (right!),
Steve
1) Paterno cut all ties with Sandusky very abruptly after the Ray Gricar investigation. He refused to keep Sandusky on staff and wouldn’t even attend his retirement ceremony even though he was in his own home that evening. That speaks volumes.
2) Your statement “Maybe start asking questions about the Second Mile, the 98 investigation, Corbett, Gricar, and such instead.” fails to point out that all those separate issues are intertwined with the four men we are discussing now.
Can you really sit there and say that Paterno, Curley and Spanier didn’t know there were investigations and about the Second Mile? All these circumstances are intertwined with the power structure of State College which is PSU – and nobody at PSU were more powerful than Paterno, Curley and Spanier. No one, not the Chief of Police or, apparently, the DA back in ’98.
Paterno may not have been the “master puppeteer of State College putting pride and legacy before children’s welfare”, at least not before 2002 and even that is debatable. But he was THE integral pivot point in whether these men went forward with a plan that would have confronted Sandusky, informed the Second mile and informed Children’s Welfare division. Paterno levered Curley into not making this public and because that happened at least one young but was abused:
“Victim 9: Now 18, he testified that he was sexually abused by Sandusky at the Sandusky home where he spent more than a hundred nights in a room in the basement that had a waterbed. He testified he was subject to oral then anal sex and screamed for help. He was also abused in a State College hotel and other locations between July 2005 and December 2008, according to prosecutors. He was 12-15 at the time. Sandusky was convicted of involuntary deviate sexual intercourse (two counts), indecent assault, unlawful contact with a minor, corruption of minors, endangering a child’s welfare.”
Sorry, but you have to be blind, deaf and dumb to think there weren’t many, many more boys abused after that string of emails were written.
So let’s not gloss over what is more and more becoming facts in this case. Paterno had a grand chance to practice what he preached and he CHOSE not to. Get that – he CHOSE not to.
He wasn’t passive here, he was aggressive in his decision making and that will be his legacy.
Nope. McQueary’s testimony contradicted the Grand Jury presentment which was written by the prosecuting attorney for media manipulative purposes.
Also, maybe stop with the epithets and write like an adult.
Steve1: Like I said to TX Panther, this notion that Paterno was told specifically of rape is false. No one here knows exactly what was said to Paterno.
Reed: Levered Curly? Aggressive in his decision making? None of that is in the emails or testimony; it’s all your interpretation predicated on a view of State College/PSU in which Paterno is some sort of overseeing king.
This young woman had no connection to PSU athletics. So how could a football coach not be aware? Apparently Tom Bradley has now been implicated. How can PSU justify retaining two coachs from Paterno’s staff? Well they were (at least Larry Johnson was)intimately involved with recruiting.That has enabled O’Brien to recruit much better that you would expect a first year coach coming from the pros to recruit.”Cleaned house” indeed!
In the last week Chas and I put up 13 pieces that didn’t deal with the PSU scandal. 13 Rev! Blogs that have a stable of writers don’t usually pump out two articles a day. Compare that to The Blather which has two writers contributing.
With all due respect it is apparent you have reached your limit of PSU talk and that is understandable. Without sounding too snotty, because you know how valued your presence on this board is, perhaps you should just skip over those articles which don’t interest you.
When PITT football issues arise we will post articles about that first and foremost but if I’m taking three hours out of my day, writing 1000+ words and I’m faced with a choice of writing something of substance vice a puff piece on PITT – I’ll do the former every time.
1) When the original GJ report came out, it was “wait until all the facts come out”, when McQueary screwed up the year (man he seems like a wishy washy backboneless fish) the Nitters were “see, this was all made up”….. And….”Joe did what he was supposed to do, he reported it to his superiors”.
Then the rioting and ridiculous idol worshipping at Paterno’s lawn.
2) Then it went to trial, and as each victim testified to the heinous and gory details emerge in gut wrenching emotional testimony, it is worse, much worse than any of us really imagine and Sandusky was charged with 45 counts of sexual abuse.
3) Now the investigations begin, the civil suits begin, and now discovery on PSU’s culpability begins. Quickly, e-mails that implicate Joe as not just complicit, but possibly the orchestrator of the cover up is leaked. Also, e-mails surfaced (that honestly have previously been ignored because the focus was on Jerry) indicate the complete lack of institutional discipline regarding football players. There dots not that are being connected, and the investigation is in its relative infancy. What next?
4) IMO….just like with Sandusky, it will get worse. If this crew was guilty of covering up and therefore aiding and unbetting a serial child rapists (remember Ol Ticklemonster shared quarters in Spanier’s box for Joe’s 409th win) this is just the tip of a very big iceberg.
You know it is funny. For over 30 years, avid Penn State fans spoke of Joe as this incredible man, with his finger on the pulse of everything. They used to say “he knew if a player cut class, he knew if they jaywalked”. Now, alot of these same fans are painting Joe as some feeble, adleminded grandpa who couldn’t turn on a computer. Wasn’t only a year ago or so they lauded him for embracing technology such as Skype?
What is it folks? Sad thing is, deep down, you already know.
Hail to Pitt!
[steps on soap box]
People not wanting to hear about it because it is uncomfortable and troubling is part of what creates a context where this stuff (and many other bad things) can happen and fester in the first place.
Now, we all kinda have to deal with this because despite that PSU is clearly and by very far the worst offender, the preferential treatment of big time college sports (football and at times b-ball) at the expense of all other things is prevelent everywhere. I’m not comparing or tying the awful sins of PSU with or to any other school. Just saying it is relevant.
[steps off soap box]
i) you only need one victim for brushing it under the rug to be a heinous crime.
ii) yes, they did brush it under the rug, knowingly full well that something was amiss….something so heinous that you do not take any risks and just assume that only one instance of ‘horsing around’ in the shower took place.
No. sorry Kyle. They knew enough that they should have taken actual action. That much is abundantly clear and evidenced. What’s coming to light is that they probably even knew more than that.
That’s it. Nothing else really needs to be said. Paterno had a moral and ethical obligation the minute McQueary talked to him about what he saw, yet aside from doing the barest of legal things he did nothing to ensure other children’s safety.
I understand the viewpoint your Dad is coming from but I think he’s wrong. But let’s say Paterno did wait for them to confront Sandusky head on – then that means he was willing to let things slide with just a dressing down to Sandusky… BECAUSE THAT IS ALL THAT HAPPENED.
What about after those two weeks, two months, hell even two years? Not a damned thing was done and Sandusky was allowed, by those exact same people, to bring young boys onto the campus and into the athletic facilities – even going so far as having those young boys accompany him, at PSU’s expense mind you, to Bowl games.
There is no way around this. It is the worst of human behavior to harbor and enable someone you know is a danger to children just because if that knowledge got out it might harm the university.
Paterno placed his team, his desires and his ego over the souls and hearts of helpless children he knew had been raped.
What a punk! Say hello to Adolph, Osama, Dahmer and the rest of your crowd Joe…you have an eternity with them you creep.