Setting aside the arguments that know we are going to get into on a regular basis from now until Sept. 1 regarding who should be our starting QB going into the 2012 season, lets discuss how we got to be where we are today with that position and what this staff needs to do to correct it.
I’m going to piggy-back on Chris Peak’s work over at Rivals.com with his excellent article on the subject. Please read it in its entirety and post your thoughts after you finish with this post. (Thanks Chris, great work).
Needless to say we just experience a full six years under Dave Wannstedt where it was obvious that his idea of an offense didn’t begin with a top shelf QB. He was stuck in his NFL rut to where he felt that if every other aspect of the offense is strong then all the QB has to be is a delivery system for getting the ball to the running backs.
His choice of NFL QBs ain’t Murder’s Row. When he was HC of the Bears he had: Harbaugh, Walsh, Kramer, Krieg and Mirer. Wait, it gets better. When he was HC of the Dolphins he had Dan Marino, whom he forced out for Fielder and followed up with A.J. Feeley. Awesome Dave!
At PITT he took his inherited QB, Tyler Palko (It’s Tyler Time!!) anointed him the starter basically forcing Flacco to split and then tied one hand behind Palko’s back to fit that NFL mold. Flacco’s leaving left us with nothing after Palko.
Problems continued because of this – “Of course, those issues were compounded when neither of the quarterbacks signed in Dave Wannstedt’s first class – Kevan Smith and Dexter Davidson – turned out to be viable options. ”
OK guys, you can break out the kleenex now and I’m sorry to have reminded you. Kevan Smith and Dexter Davidson. Two answers to PITT trivia questions 25 years from now. My God.
Does that sound familiar? “neither… turned out to be viable options”? Think Myers, Gonzalez and Anderson this season.
Because that boulder of crap rolls downhill, here is the crux of our QB situation as it stands in 2012 and Chris Peak nails it with this thought.
There is considerable evidence in favor of signing at least one quarterback in every recruiting class. Pitt didn’t sign a quarterback in the recruiting class of 2004 (Walt Harris’ final class), so the transfer of Joe Flacco (Pitt’s 2003 quarterback recruit) after spring camp 2005 left Pitt in a vulnerable position two years later when the coaches had to turn to true freshman Pat Bostick for the bulk of the 2007 season.
Similar to what we have with the Sunseri/Voytik situation today. PITT fans want to see anyone but Sunseri and that means in most cases Voytik. But we need to remember what transpired with Pat Bostick also. Sometimes a true freshman just isn’t ready to step in and compete at this level.
I admire Bostick for his 2007 season and there are many reasons for that but the one that means the most to me is the way he battled through adversity and kept his head up when nothing else seemed to be going right.
But do we even want to put Chad Voytik in that same situation? We can talk about character, maturity, guts, cool under pressure, etc. until we are blue in the face but the bald truth is that we have no idea how this 18 year old kid is going to react under the pressures of college football.
That’s why HCs at this level almost always redshirt these kids, so they have time to acclimate in every aspect of being a student athlete. More importantly the HCs and staff then have time to really evaluate the QBs strengths and weaknesses to see what they have in him.
But here’s the scary part when looking at our recent past. DW followed that 2007 season up with shoving his chips forward in getting Greg Cross – who couldn’t accurately throw a bucket of water if his feet were burning – and then Kolby Grey. Grey is an excellent example of coaching ineptitude at its finest. DW went on Craig’s List to find a QB and Grey responded.
Following the timeline, then, Bostick was the only quarterback in the class of 2007, and Wannstedt followed that by signing Tino Sunseri and Greg Cross the next year. The coaches entered the recruiting class of 2009 without any plans to sign a quarterback, but the 2008 season’s quarterback debacles – capped by the 3-0 Sun Bowl loss – changed those plans in a hurry.
Scrambling at essentially the last minute, Wannstedt signed Kolby Gray as that year’s quarterback. The next year, offensive coordinator Frank Cignetti missed on several national quarterback prospects, instead turning to Mark Myers and Anthony Gonzalez (although not all of the staff was sold on Gonzalez as a quarterback). The coaches then planned to sign Gary Nova in the class of 2011, but those plans fell apart with Wannstedt’s resignation/firing.
Forward to the present. Chryst is now left with a substand QB roster and has to try to win football games with it. That’s this season. For the future he has both Voytik, who was recruited by Graham, and Chandler Kincade in the class of 2014… maybe.
Paul Chryst and the coaching staff have been getting to know Kincade, and while he has been looking at other schools, the odds seem to favor Kincade sticking with his commitment to Pitt.
Assuming Kincade stays with the Panthers, this sets up an interesting decision for the coaching staff to make in the recruiting class of 2013 (the class they’re currently building). Simply put, should the coaches make it a point to sign a quarterback?
This is the deal. Chryst didn’t recruit either Voytik of Kincade. They may not be what this staff sees behind center at all. That means two things. It doesn’t matter what they think for 2012 because this is the hand they were dealt and 2) they must get someone who they do envision behind center ASAP.
Pitt’s current quarterback situation also can’t be ignored: Sunseri graduates after this year, meaning the 2013 roster will be Myers, Anderson, Voytik, and walk-on redshirt senior transfer Tom Savage (assuming Gonzalez moves to another position); that leaves Myers, Anderson, Voytik and, most likely, Kincade in 2014. Another name in that mix would seem to be a good thing.
If they skip a year here in recruiting a QB and Voytik doesn’t develop, we have to march out either Myers or Anderson in 2013 and probably 2014 give that Kincade will be a true freshman that season also. Imagine how this will impact the football program for the future. We could have six straight years of below par play if that come to pass, Sunseri for three years and then whomever for the next three.
I’m getting heartburn just typing this.
In my opinion Chryst has to recruit at least one QB per year at least until we are sure we have a QB who will give us multiple years of decent play at that position. Hopefully that will be Voytik in 2013 after he has a year in the meetings and in practices to get ready for play at the D1 level .
If that doesn’t pan out with Voytik then zip up your G-suit because we will be pulling some major pressure in our rapid descent on the football scene.
I bleed Blue and Gold. I didn’t go to Pitt but Pitt is near Greensburg (and has a campus here) so they’re my college team (more so than PSU ever could be.)
But….come on, seriously. Pitt has be relevant since 1976. Even Dan Marino couldn’t make this program relevant in the late 70s and early 80s.
I mean the last time you heard Pitt and National Championship was when they beat WVU 13-9. Please don’t act like we even matter in the Big Least. We don’t.
I do hope things turn around but as it stands right now, I don’t see that happening any time soon.
A big disappointment this year was not having Mr. Voytik enroll in January. Early enrollment is critical in the new college landscape. It means a true freshman has almost nine months in the program to learn before a season starts. A huge advantage when a commit really wants to join a program!
So to answer the question, a qb each year is great if they are qualified to be high major talents. At some point later, PC can take developmental projects, but he needs depth first.
But if you don’t think PITT can get a lot worse and stay there then you missed the 1990’s. During that decade we were 37-72-1, averaging less than four wins per year.
PITT fans jump up and down tearing their hair out at last year’s 6-6 regular season record when that would have been the best year in that time period.
If I remember correctly I read somewhere that his academics were in place to do that but he chose not to. Which makes me wonder.
I’m not betting the house on Voytik for 2012 at all as some PITT fans are. 2013 is a different matter though.
And yes, I did miss the 90s. I was barely 10 years old in the 90s and had to deal with moving from foster care to group homes.
My point is in 2012 there is no rapid descent. We’re already a joke due to the coaches. We’ve never outright won the big east or a BCS game. I don’t know really know if Pitt as a national identity can sink any lower.
I’ve been upset with the mediocrity.
I’ll go with mediocrtiy, middle of the pack and yes, not nationally relevant, but, a joke, nope, not buying that one.
Enjoy your weekend!
I don’t know what the formula for keeping a fresh QB (or a elite QB)around that can run the first team, but Pitt has never had it…..at least since Bobby Haygood and Matt Cavanaugh in 1976
The Coaching Carousel has made us a joke. Apparently going to the ACC over the Big XII has made us a joke.
Like I said the Panthers biggest win was 13-9 and that’s already 5-6 years old for anyone to give a damn.
“But….come on, seriously. Pitt has be relevant since 1976. Even Dan Marino couldn’t make this program relevant in the late 70s and early 80s.”
I don’t know what you were drinking(and smoking) in the late 1970’s and early 80’s but it must of been some good shit.
PITT was VERY RELEVANT in the late 70’s and early 80’s as we were 33-3 from 1980-1982.
With the 1980 team being ranked #2 to finish the season, as we got jobbed in the bowl selection farce. BTW, the NY TIMES final season poll had PITT ranked #1. That team had the best collection of defensive players who went on to become stars in the NFL as maybe ANY college team EVER. (do the names Hugh Green, Ricky Jackson & Bill Maas ring a bell). The following year we were ranked #1 most of the season and finished beating the great SEC’s champion, Georgia in the Sugar Bowl and ranked #4 in the final poll.
Not relevant, we were the best team in the country those two years combined, 22-2. #2 & #4. What are u nuts or a disguised hoopie, nitter.
The following year(1982) we were the Pre-Season #1 ranked team and were # 1 for part of the season.
Are you sure you were awake during this time period ? 🙂
P.S. We also finished ranked #7 in 1979 and #10 in 1982, just to further jog ur memory.
It seems to me that is played up mostly by the anti-PITT infested media in Pittsburgh. And of course the pedophiles who have matriculated to Creepy Valley and the tards who couldn’t get into PITT and reside in Hooterville.
When I remind these fine folks of ALL the GREAT players PITT has produced over the years, that is what their impression of PITT football becomes.
And nobody, not the pedophile lovers in the Pittsburgh media nor the inbred tards of Hooterville can TAKE THAT AWAY from us. And our Nine (9) National Championships of course !!
Veritas et Virtus !
Hail to Pitt !
This is why I like going to the ACC so much. At least academically we are with the group where we belong. Prestige doesn’t only come from your athletic teams.
And I am hardly a Hoopie, which you would know if you had actually read my post instead of picking the “important” parts.
And yes, playing C-CUSA team and UConn hasn’t helped. The only decent competition we’ve had is ND and WVU.
Moving to the ACC in football gives us FSU, Miami (I hope), VT, UVA and Clemson and more recently NC State and Wake Forest. That’s 7 quality conference games right there–basically the ENTIRE Big East conference.
Right NOW Pitt is a joke. We see empty seats at Heinz Field, we don’t travel to bowl games, etc. Something needs to change not only about the team but about the fans.
I believe a joke is 0-12, 1-11, 2-9, that’s all.
Believe me, I’ve been as critical as anyone.
I’ve been disgusted by the Compass Bowl and Belk Bowl.
Again, as bad as I’ve been on these last years, going to a bowl, means you’re in the top half of 120 teams for the most part.
Oh, I just had an ephiphany.
Here ya go. The last years to me have been mediocre, and I haven’t been too happy.
Johnny Majors II was a JOKE!!! 2-9’s, peppered with 67-0 losses several times. (scores there abouts).
So, all I’m saying is, I wouldn’t consider the last 10 years a joke, stuck in mediocrity in my mind.
Hey, we all have different definitions!
No, not the Big 4, but with the teams you mentioned, will be a hell of a good conference, and frankly, and I’m not kidding, if FSU, Miami, Va Tech Ga Tech stay, I wouldn’t want to be in another conference.
The geography is wear we should be, and the academics, hoops, and the football would be ideal for me and I believe Pitt.
They can call us the 5th conference, could care less, I know we should be playing Maryland and Virginia, and not Texaa Tech and Baylor.
NOW, big NOW, if FSU, Miami, Ga Tech and or Va tech leave………all bets are off.
Would not be the same conference my mind signed up four. Would be a big disappointment.
Yes, they could cobble something together, and it would be better than the Big East ever was, but, no way to sugar coat it, if FSU and Clemson leave, they will take some prestige with them.
Even though FSU and Miami haven’t done anything lately, they still have some cache’ and it would hurt if they left.
Harris would have been hung in effigy had he not started Palko and Wanny all but promised Palko the job. Wanny would not have allowed Flaco to prosper and the parade of second rate QBs since then has scared top prospects away.
All Chryst has to do is start the best player. Recruits know damn well if the best player is playing. Wanna recruit the best player? Make sure your recruits see you playing your best.
You people will apparently be shocked of just how productive Palko was in his senior season when he had more TD passes than anyone in the BE including Bryan Brohm and also had the highest passer rating, not to mention that Pitt averaged over 30 points game … look it up.
And back then, I certainly didn’t remember any outcry when Flacco decided to transfer. Pitt’s problem in Palko’s jr and sr season was clealy the defense not being able to defend the likes of Brohm, Bush, White, Slaton, Rice and Leonard.
Bostick was supposedly Cavanuagh’s big prize recruit, and even a 5 star by Scout.com. But all in all, Wanny’s teams, pro and college, did lack the the big time QB … and despite a winning record at Miami and Pitt, certainly did not meet expectations.
But now we are in a new era and once again hope sring eternal with a accomplished NCAA proven offensive coach. Take heart
Since 2006, can anyone guess how many qb’s were even drafted into the league out of the BE and ACC? This is a shocking statistic but really shows the importance of having a great signal caller. That is one of my main reasons for supporting PC so hard. He can develop qb’s that get drafted. That is key to program success.
Oh, the answer…..2. In the interim, the SEC had 12 and I believe the big 10 and pac 11 also had 12 or so each. That statistic alone is telling. The qb touches the ball on most every offensive play, ours unfortunately runs out of bounds six yards behind the line alot, but that’s another story!
So again, no room for projects at qb. Let’s sign some good ones, coach em up and get em drafted. Thanks Reed for the followup on Voytik. Early enrollment is so important if you want early playing time.
I agree that the heat would have been terrible had DW sat down Palko after that SO year Palko had.
I also agree that Palko had a decent statistical (TDs and rating) in his SR year when he was 4th in the nation in passing efficiency.
What I was alluding to was the offense DW ran for his QB to execute took away some of the possibilities that Tyler Palko’s talent could have given us.
I believe that in 2006, Palko’s SR year, he was pretty much handcuffed by DW regardless of what efficiency stats were. That was the year we finished 6-6 and lost the last five games – scoring an average of 20 ppg in regulation time during those five losses.
DW ran a run heavy 55%/45% play split and only got 3.9 ypc out of it. Our top two runners only gave us 1100 yards which was why we were 78th nationally in rushing.
2005 was even worse when we had 1285 total yards (93rd nationally).
With running games like we had in 2005 & 06 it wouldn’t have hurt to open up the passing game more and let Palko try to win with his arm.
Hindsight is 20/20 but I think DW was just inflexible as hell with Palko.
A lot of big issues on this thread.
Do you need a great QB to be a great team? No but it helps.
Is it better to be in the ACC even if a couple teams leave? Absolutely.
Do great teams usually have great coaches? Duh.
The landscape in college sports is always changing. Right now the SEC is far superior than anyone else. Will this always be so?
The two biggest problems that Pitt has are somewhat related. Superstars want to play in packed houses of crazy fans. Seldom the case at Pitt. The Steelers suck all of the life out of all Pittsburgh sports especially Pitt Football.
Even with Dorsett, Marino, Hugh Green, and the cast of future Hall of Famers, there were many empty seats.
The good news, we may have a great coach, our new conference should increase excitement and entertainment, hope they travel well. Pittsburgh is a great city to visit.
As I said before, we need to play two of the three each year, PSU, ND and WVU. These teams will pack the stadium. How many half filled stadiums do you see in the SEC or Big whatever?
When PSU plays William & Mary there are over 100,000 in attendance. When Pitt plays Youngstown…
Let the new era begin!
Wouldn’t ber a memorial day without thanking the troops and their families for giving us the ability to mock steve p, when we want.
Seriously, thanks to the troops, their families and all our ancestors for giving so much and getting so little back in return! There are many local families that have lost fathers, husbands, brothers, uncles and we do so little for them. Perhaps Pitt can don the mustard and yellow once per year in memory of the locals, inviting them to a game. I would donate for their experience on gameday!
4 since 2005 in Big East.
6 in ACC
12 big 12
12 sec
10 big 10
12 Pac12
i think i went by rosters made post draft. That said, the above are the totals drafted. Point being is that playmakers don’t typically come from our conference but with PC, I think that trend goes in a different direction.
I’m sure there are a few more.
Just win baby win.
Unfortunately, so does the ACC. PC needs to change the trend. In all fairness, the 7 team big east should produce less just because of the number of participating schools. Perception is often reality for kids and as such, the names you mentioned and the ones Tony C mentioned does not give you the warm and fuzzies for qb play.
Voytik should be redshirted for both Pitt and his long term future, but when we Pitt fans admit this, it means we are doomed to ANOTHER year of gut-wrenching, hair-pulling, inept QB play. Honestly, don’t we deserve a break?
