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May 24, 2012

Unintentional honesty is always fun. There’s the confirmation of what has been rumored, plus the hilarious attempts to walk it back. The latest, TCU AD Chris Del Conte talking about the Big 12.

Del Conte is in Lubbock this morning speaking to a Committee for Champions breakfast on the Texas Tech campus. According to Chris Level, who is the publisher of RedRaiderSports.com and a co-host of a radio show on 104.3 FM in Lubbock; he Tweeted that Del Conte said that the once dead Big 12 “now has schools like Florida State, Clemson and Miami trying to get in.”

This is called a confirmation, and it’s actually on the record.

Not that Del Conte is actually in a hurry to expand the Big 12 — now that TCU is in.

“From my standpoint of right now, I want to stay let’s take our breath. We are in a position of strength. Let’s not rush into anything. We know expansion has to happen. It may not be for a while. We are in the catbird seat right now. We don’t need to rush it. You are excited all of these teams want into the Big 12 and two years ago it was going to disintegrate.”

So how did Del Conte attempt to walk it back? By claiming that he was only commenting on the rumors of teams trying to get into the Big 12. Of course he was. Not actual ACC programs trying to get into to the Big 12.

As for the abrupt and sudden instability of the ACC. Dan Wetzel blames it on the ACC and Big East not being aggressive enough in pushing the playoff structure in college football to 8 teams.

That is why for the ACC, Big East and other conferences, the risks are enormous here, the stakes considerable.

They still have their best stability card left to be played, one move that can strengthen their leagues, assure their future and likely stem the realignment tides that don’t bode well for them: They could scream, politick and push relentlessly for the creation of an eight-team playoff that features six automatic bids and two at-large selections, with the quarterfinals and semifinals played on campus and the title game bid out.

The odds of getting that done, at this point, are slim to none, if not impossible. Too much time probably has passed. If these leagues ever do die, it’ll be because of passivity, inertia and complimentary his-and-her Caribbean cruises courtesy of the bowl lobby.

Dan Wetzel is one of the biggest proponents for the playoff system in college football. He is the author of the book: Death to the BCS. So, it seems amusing to me that he is essentially advocating adapting the BCS to playoffs. Six automatic bids plus two at-large.

I’m not sure he is right. Especially since his reasoning is that a 8-team playoff would be super-giant money for all conferences. Coupled with the potentially easier path into the playoffs if you were in the Big East or ACC, is a disincentive to jump to other conferences. That completely discounts the greed of programs. It wouldn’t change the envious, lustful eyes of programs at the money going to other conferences on TV deals they get. FSU would still be pissed at the difference between the ACC TV deal and the SEC’s.

The  ACC media deal with ESPN continues to get scrutinized. The Clemson AD revealed how big football mattered when he stated that the split in revenue was about 80% football related and only 20% for basketball.

TN: In your opinion, how does that move affect the ACC?

TDP: The ACC- we just got back from our spring meetings. Certainly, there were a lot of things discussed down there. The conference and the membership well understand what is happening. For example, in this latest contract with ESPN, 80% of it is generated by football. As good as basketball has been in the ACC, it is very evident just through this contract that football has to be very, very relevant. And the conference is well aware of that and they are going to be turning over every stone that they can and not just sitting on this contract. For example this new contract has two look-in windows- one at five years and one at 10 years. The purpose of that – in talking with ESPN people and our people in the same room – is to look at the end of five years where are we- competitively, what’s our performance, and does it merit a significant increase in the rights fee. There’s no question that on ESPN, the rights to television money is larger than any other conference. They’ve got other- the SEC has CBS and other conferences have other carriers, but there is tremendous exposure for the ACC football games as well as basketball games and other Olympic sports. As far as exposure, it’s a very good contract. Dollar wise as far as what ESPN is paying, it’s at the top, but overall because of the lack of CBS, you don’t have the same kind of dollars that other conferences have. But, having said that, ESPN has made it very clear that the purpose of writing in those look-ins is to see where we are in five years. You don’t wait until the end of the 15 years to say, ‘hey, how are we doing?’ That’s the purpose of the five-year and the ten-year look-in to challenge our conference and all of us associated with the conference know that football is extremely important and we have to perform and do everything we can to perform.

TN: Does the ACC contract put the conference’s schools at a competitive disadvantage?

TDP: You’ve got to look at what occurred during the period of time that it was negotiated. One of the interesting things that I’ve heard, with regards to the negotiations is that the conference didn’t do a good job negotiating. What’s interesting is that a lot of these conferences use the same consultants when dealing with the networks. When I came out here from the Big XII to the ACC, we had the same consultant that we had in the Big XII, and so what you have as a package has to speak for itself and provide whatever leverage that you have to negotiate at the highest rate. Some of these contracts- you’re really not privy to- they’re not subject to FOIA because they are privately owned and not for non-profit so you can’t get it there. The only way you can get information- not the provisions- is through tax returns which is always retrospective. You try to understand where you are, but you don’t have a quick and easy way to see what the provisions are. For example as reported, in the Pac 12, when they negotiated their contract- I guess it came about a year after the ACC negotiated its contract- at the time Fox and ESPN with the ACC were bidding against one another. What occurred in the Pac 12, I guess it was NBC Comcast, they came in as a bidder and Fox and ESPN joined forces to keep the other out of the market so that drove up the market value of that contract because of the market dynamics of what occurred at that particular point and time- a new group wanting to come in and get a piece of the college football landscape. And Fox and ESPN determined not to let them have a piece of the landscape so they came together and joined forces to preempt NBC Comcast. Then on top of it, the Pac 12 pulled in all of the multimedia contracts from all of the member institutions which pull that out of the control of the individual school and put it in the conference office, and now they have the multimedia rights. They control these third tier rights for the conference schools, which is part of that figure. Here, you say, ‘ok, what’s it worth to Clemson if you look at the Pac 12 model?’ We probably on our rights pull in 4.5 million annually and maybe a little more so you add that on top- that’s your sponsorships, radio, printed publications, and all of that. So, you could pull in those kinds of rights and put it on top of your television contract and instead of it being 17 million, it’s 21 million in a similar format as the Pac 12. Not being privy and not knowing what’s in the contracts, you don’t know what rights are in there. You only know what’s reported, and that’s sometimes accurate and sometimes not accurate. The conference offices don’t release those contracts and the only thing you can look at are the tax returns of the not-for-profit conference member offices. You don’t know what the provisions are or where those numbers are coming from.

For what it is worth Clemson’s AD also expressed confidence in the ACC in understanding how important football is to the conference.

That 80-20 split is also enlightening as to why the basketball schools in the Big East are full of bluster, but little else. They know (or at least they should) that if the football splits off, they will see their TV revenue (and exposure) fall through the floor. They’d be lucky to get more than $3 million a year on the deal.

On the whole debate of the ACC being a basketball conference. That the conference doesn’t care (enough) about football and football interests. A UNC blogger is about sick of it.

Being traditionally good at basketball is sin; it drives football coaches away, it makes the TV executives sad, it upsets the natural order of things and leads to conference doom. Doom, I say!

Yawn.

These folks can never actually delineate the point when the ACC and its member schools “chose” basketball over football. Because it never happened. The best you can say is that in 1953, the member schools left the Southern Conference in part to participate in post-season play, and eventually established higher academic standards than the SEC. Beyond that, the ACC pursued football at every turn.

Almost every expansion move has been wholly football-related. Georgia Tech had one NCAA appearance before joining the conference in 1979; the same goes for Florida State when they signed on in 1991. Miami and Boston College were pure football plays, while Virginia Tech was forced upon the conference but still was only known for their gridiron performance. By the time of the last expansion, their weren’t that many good schools willing to jump ship, and still the conference got the best regional football programs available.

Even in Chapel Hill, football success is constantly being chased. Kenan Stadium has been expanded twice in the last twenty years.

He makes a good case. And while UNC is clearly a basketball school, it can’t be denied how they have chased football success in the last 15 plus years. Failed. But it has definitely been chased.

Perception plays a role. It’s how everyone else views the ACC. The ACC offices are in Charlotte, NC. Hence the conference favors the NC schools — and those schools lean basketball. ACC Commissioner Swofford is a former UNC AD. You have two member institutions in Duke and Wake Forest (also located in NC) that are primarily about basketball.

There’s also the fact that even when the conference has expanded for football, the votes were not unanimous (and at time bitterly fought). Add in the generally poor ACC officiating in football — with seemingly little apparent interest in improving it. Plus careless to downright stupid conference scheduling that seems to punish football programs — last year having FSU and Clemson meet early in the season, and the week after both programs faced quality non-con opponents. This despite the fact that both were expected to contend for divisional titles is an example. Meanwhile, basketball scheduling works very hard to set the matches in the right time.

And of course, there is this past year’s acceptance of Pitt and Syracuse. A reaction to the potential expansiopocolypse of the Pac-12 getting to part of the Big 12 while the SEC takes more. Competitively it has been seen by most as something that does more for basketball and next to nothing in football. Afterall, Syracuse has been really bad for most of the decade in football. Pitt has been distinctly mediocre. Both, however, have been very strong in basketball.





One of the nice things about leaving the Big East was that supposedly these conference raid scares would be a thing of the past…guess not.

Comment by Coach Ditka 05.24.12 @ 11:03 am

Chas, not to blow smoke up your skirt, but again I want to thank you for how you design this blog. Your efforts to draw enlightened information to the forefront of discussion is such a refreshing break from the constant hyperbole printed elsewhere. Your work give everyone the opportunity to see the larger picture and put things into appropriate context without the drumbeat of “source” conjecture or a new prognostication of what is to come.

Thank you again.

Comment by ECH 05.24.12 @ 11:28 am

I was always curious what the hell these schools were talking about when they claimed basketball school bias. Like having Duke and UNC win championships is sucking the mojo from FSU and Clemson.

Comment by Chris 05.24.12 @ 11:28 am

Seriously….with the Penn St ad at the top!

Comment by Jason 05.24.12 @ 12:17 pm

[…] the original post here: Pitt Blather Permalink » ACC Expansiopocolypse: Sorting Some … ← Borussia Dortmund – a Team on the Way to Be One of the World's […]


Good article by Dan Wetzel. It appears the ACC is just as stupid as the Big East. Yet I love our new conference. Just don’t want to be left out in the cold regarding football playoffs.

Comment by Rayhpgh 05.24.12 @ 12:26 pm

I think the BCS should go to a 8 team playoff where 8 teams play New Years Day the 4 big bowls leading to a 4 teams to 2 teams playing two weeks into JAN.
The Bowl games are still big, the smaller bowl game format still exists and if your claiming your the 8/9th best team ‘Forget About It’.

Comment by Tackle made by HUGH 05.24.12 @ 12:32 pm

what a difference there is in the ACC vs BE where one conference has all it schools participating in all sports, whie the other conference has half of its teams not participating in the biggest revenue sport.

Heck, I could remember Pitt people back in the 90s claiming that the eastern seaboard teams were getting favoritism in the BE while Pitt, being the western-most school, was being ignored.

Complain all you want but if all schools are participating in all sports and getting an equal share, then you have to look inward if you are struggling and others within the conference aren’t.

Comment by wbb 05.24.12 @ 12:57 pm

Well said wbb.

Comment by ECH 05.24.12 @ 1:34 pm

Posted this on a few articles back, but, I was last poster and it might be a dead article.

I realize there is no way this would happen, with money and everything else, so, I’m saying up front, this is just from Fantasyland!!!

If the “Big 4” conferences leave the rest out, or make it extremly difficult to get in, I figure those conferences have about 48 members or so.

The other 72 schools, ACC, BE, Mntw West and including the Sun Belt, all of them………..

should break off from the Big 4, and never schedule any games against them.

Let them eat each other. And if they decide they want a cupcake, they’ll have to go to a div 2 school for a game.

Just have to play each other for all 12 games, beat the crap out of each other.

See how much fun it would be playing only each other, and at the end, have 10-2 teams playing each other.

Yes, I’m dreaming of course, but, I’d love it.

Comment by Dan 05.24.12 @ 1:49 pm

Join the Ivy League. Screw the $.

I’ll go up to Hanover to watch Pitt play even in a snow storm.

Comment by steve1 05.24.12 @ 2:42 pm

info please will not the teams ranked 1 thru 4 in the new formet be the ones in the play off there will still be polls so if FSU or PITT or vt
is undefated they are in the 4 team play off right so what is the worry you cant make the playoff from the big ten if your champ is ranked number 9 or from the big 12 if your champ is ranked number 7 can you it is the top 4 teams right or wrong.

Comment by Frankcan 05.24.12 @ 2:56 pm

An 8 team playoff – that ship has already sailed. We are at a very critical junction regarding who fills the 4 team playoff slots. If the ACC and Big East were smarter, both would have fought with all their might for 8 slots to make sure the ACC was included as the Mountain West did so valiantly.

Comment by Rayhpgh 05.24.12 @ 2:59 pm

help me out if you are ranked 1 thru 4 you are in right so just win all your games if you lose 2 or 3 games you should not be in any way so who care abought big 12 champ or pac ten champ they could be ranked 12 or 13 th it is the top 4 so if you are really good you should be in what is the worry please explain if bye some chance the sec champ loses 3 games they wont be in right will there still be polls if so you wont be in top 4 with 3 loses.

Comment by Frankcan 05.24.12 @ 3:31 pm

As the saying goes It is what it will be.

I seriously doubt the BIG 4 will not have an at large spot. If they do not then they will lose a lot of TV eyes. And the TV networks know this.

Comment by Frank 05.24.12 @ 3:39 pm

@steve1 Pitt would save a lot of money on athletic scholarships if we joined the Ivy League – they don’t have any. And, since we don’t travel well to post-season bowls, the fact that the Ivy League doesn’t play in any won’t matter much. Forget Hanover. Tailgating in New Haven or Cambridge is something to experience.

Comment by Pitt Dad 05.24.12 @ 3:44 pm

Ah! The joys of tailgating with Chateaubriand and Lobster washed down with Chateauneuf du Pape in Cambridge, Massachusetts!

Comment by pitt1972 05.24.12 @ 3:53 pm

Well Frankcan, ya, you’re mostly correct. Waiting to see what the playoff format will be, and WHO and HOW they will determine rankings.

If they leave a spot open, and rankings are based on something tangible, then, yes, it’s up to each individual team. Someone goes 12-0 and wins the conf champ game to go 13-0, ya, gonna be in the top 4.

Thats what people are waiting to see.

They are still deciding things. Who are they??

Now, they use some strange way of doing the top 20, and using some sort of strength of schedule that stacks the deck against outside conferences, that would still have a 13-0 Virginia Tech finishing 8th or something like that, then there are problems.

If there is an open, fair chance for an outside team to have a great season, and get ranked accordingly, then, maybe ok.

Comment by Dan 05.24.12 @ 4:09 pm

@Frank, I agree. Not saying this from a defensive position either.

Better be careful, you leave 60-70 teams out of a “chance”, your eyes will be dwindling.

Lowest rated NC champ game in years last year and I was one of them. We all love college football on here, that is a given.

I have to say, as much as I love it, I didn’t watch the game. Not to make a statement or anything, I just had no interest a few days before the game.

Night of the game, I turned it on for the kickoff, watched about 5 or 6 plays, and said, “that’s enough, I just saw this game 4 weeks ago or so”.

My point being, a lot of people out there think “oh college football, basketball, the NFL could never lose ratings.” Wrong.

Especially when you screw with it.

Actually, the NFL better watch what they’re doing, they end up making it a game people don’t recognize, they’re not untouchable.

Comment by Dan 05.24.12 @ 4:24 pm

Swofford better fight for conference champs. If there actually is a plus one (which the Big 4 would love with their natural semifinals), football on the East Coast north of Atlanta is dead.

Comment by Chris 05.24.12 @ 4:24 pm

Ivy League….LOL….one problem to ponder, Tino would have a difficult time against the aggressive
defenses of Columbia, Brown and Princeton.

Comment by isnore 05.24.12 @ 4:57 pm

I dont get the conference champ stuff look you can win your conference on a down year say big 10 and be 9 and 3 i would not want them in the play off
the polls are not going to go that way if the poll says byu is the number 4 team at 11 and 1 would you want a big ten team that was 9 and 3 that was ranked say number 9 in the play off just becuse they are the big 10 champs i would not. if they do that they might as well keep doeing the way they do now the ap poll and the outher polls are not goin to stop rateing teams just becuse there is a new format and if they leave the number 3 ranked team bye the polls out of the play off becuse they are not a conference champ people will scream and so would i so the hell with conference champ stuff.

Comment by Frankcan 05.24.12 @ 5:00 pm

Pitt beats Yale 29 – 29.

link to ebay.com

A must view

Comment by steve1 05.24.12 @ 5:10 pm

And then there’s this – link to nytimes.com

Comment by Pitt Dad 05.24.12 @ 5:13 pm

Dan you bring up an interesting point about the NFL. With all of the potential changes occurring in college football based solely and completely on the creation and distribution of revenue, at what point does the NFL say….”Hey, why do we have to compete with an enterprise that executes as a for profit business, yet enjoys the tax advantaged status of a non-profit? Is there a fairness issue here?” An issue that could become more and more in question as the dollar signs continue to multiply for (potentially) fewer and fewer institutions. And, will the NFL look to deflect some of the liability of former player lawsuits (especially as it pertains to concussions) back down to the collegiate and high school level? Just something to chew on…

Comment by ECH 05.24.12 @ 5:15 pm

I believe there was even a year where lowly St. Vincent College in Latrobe PA won the football championship, so anything’s possible.

Comment by Lou Gagliardi 05.24.12 @ 5:32 pm

First. Why is the NCAA silent here? The NCAA Committee chooses the top 60some bball teams for the tournament, but are silent in football. Why?

Second, if you are ranked in the top four by whatever standard, you should be in the playoff. IT is the big10, big12, pac12 and SEC that are somehow clammoring the big four and getting it confused with a four team playoff. Step back everyone. They are only promoting themselves and everyone is buying in to the hoopla. Bottom line is that if Butgers goes 12-0 and is ranked 3rd by the point system, they will be in the playoff. If BYU goes 12-0 and is ranked 4th, they are in. The point is that each school has an opportunity to get into the top 4. Just win.

Third, who the heck is the PAC 12 to garner any consideration as a football powerhouse. They have had usc and only until recently, had oregon and stanford. So inclusion there is bunk.

Finally, if the ncaa doesn’t step in, than I propose stepping out with the ACC, Big East and Mountain West. Make those other teams play championship games between 10-2 schools. That will get no play because the american public will always say they were only the best team out of 50. The public wil not support that over the long haul. The bball season is much longer and it would be cricket time when watching kansas state play northwestern…yawnville.

There is good reason to have an 8 team playoff although I prefer 12 teams. An 8 team playoff captures a byu team or boise state team that is 12-0. Over the years, those teams finished ranked at 6-8. This option would be inclusive. That said, I prefer a 12 team format where the top four finishers get a bye in the first round and then are seated appropriately for round two. It makes sense and therefore noone will accept it.

Oh, one final point on my playoff system. It would be successful if we use other examples of how much money that format generates. All you have to do is look at the professional game. They use 12 team playoff format and it works and that is why the nfl is so popular. That is also why the folks making the decisions, do so in college. It’s because in college, you are presumed not to be able to supply all the answers and that is why you go into a profession. College sports is being run by college personnel and not professionals.

Comment by dhuffdaddy 05.24.12 @ 5:45 pm

dhuffdaddy they’re silent because the BCS Committee take cares of the football side.

Comment by Lou Gagliardi 05.24.12 @ 7:00 pm

Great job chas making sense of this mess. Hail To Pitt

Comment by 63Team 05.24.12 @ 8:04 pm

@ECH, ya, never thought of that. Why would the NFL solely be responsible for concussions, the guys have been playing since they were little and getting their bell run.

@dhuffdaddy, good points. My fantasy idea that I had, I was proud that I came up with that on my own, however I googled something to the effect of “other conferences should boycott Big 4 with scheduling and basketball” and their are others out there saying “SCREW THE BIG 4”.

Ha Ha LOL, could you imagine???

“Hey Big 4″ you only get to play each other in football, and basketball”.

That wouldn’t get old quickly???

@Frankcan, you’re right on it. That’s why everyone is waiting to see what the formula will be.

Would we, as college football fans want to see a 10-3 Auburn get into the semi-finals or a major bowl instead of a 13-0 BYU?? Most of us not.

However, any one of the Big 4 would certainly rather have their 10-3 team in instead of anyone else.

I think the format is suppose to be coming out in June. Chas gave the date, can’t remember exactly.

Comment by Dan 05.25.12 @ 9:17 am

Saw Steve Pederson commented in the Trib this morning that “no way” will Pitt miss out on any playoff or suffer for joining the ACC.

This scares me to death. SP could not see the proverbial nose in front of his face. If anyone can get Pitt screwed it’s smug Steve!

Comment by Dan 72 05.25.12 @ 11:17 am

In his defense, he has to put a positive light on it … but I agree he really can be a narrow minded administrator as evidenced in 3 FB coaching hirings he made

Comment by wbb 05.25.12 @ 12:22 pm

If it were my call it would be #s 1-8 as ranked by computers and an 8-team playoff with no automatic conference winner bids. Its the fairest way possible to do it.

Comment by pitt1972 05.25.12 @ 1:30 pm

The Big East football coaches voted to never let Pitt leave the conference as long as Tino is still at QB.

Comment by Wayne 05.26.12 @ 7:51 am

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